Indestructible Engineer Vessel

Why does FTL travel mean time travel?

Faster Than Light

Well, if you travel FTL you can by definition "look back" from your destination into events that happened before you left. Therefore, you are able to witness your own past. In that sense, it is time travel. Ender (btw I loved "Ender's game"), easy answer: genetics.

@ Ender - I know what it stands for, thats not what I asked. @ Baldas - Really, says who. FTL is just a velocity, until we actually attempt to breach that speed we have no idea what will occur, regardless of what scientists say. Also take into account that 100 years ago scientists claimed it was impossible to travel faster than the speed of sound. Now we have fighter jets capable of Mach 5 (5 times the speed of sound).

IF an american research vessel is attacked by a Iranian warship ... warship will win easily and without a scratch ...that wont mean that Iranians are stronger ... In my view is the exact contrary ... that "gods" are not so invulnerable ... and probably one of their best starships is crippled by the little prometeus/magellan/Snoopy/addrandonname human ship .....hooray !! an a little swedish girl will kick their asses ...hooray !! and they will be owned by a washmachine named david ....hooray !!

[quote]@ Ender - I know what it stands for, thats not what I asked. @ Snorkle - Really, says who. FTL is just a velocity, until we actually attempt to breach that speed we have no idea what will occur, regardless of what scientists say. Also take into account that 100 years ago scientists claimed it was impossible to travel faster than the speed of sound. Now we have fighter jets capable of Mach 5 (5 times the speed of sound).[/quote] No, it's not the same as it disproves Einstein's theory or relativity, and everything in the universe is a lie.That's not the same as going faster than the speed of sound because that doesn't break the physics associated with it.Nothing, absolutely nothing should be able to travel FTL although the chaps here [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-15471118]speedy[/url] might argue that point. I really hope we don't see this in Prometheus

Snorklebottom I dont know if you're familar with Special Relativity (I am) but the general concensus in the scitntific community is FTL means time travel. I was really more interested in peoples thoughts on The Engineers technology! Baldas Enders Game is Epic! - whats the deal with your profile pic?

Here's a possibility... what if Einstein was wrong, he was human after all. Also there are two theories of relativity that he devised - General and Special, and they both contradict each other. For example... Fact - Light travels at the speed of light (obviously - can't be bothered to look up the actual speed). Do you agree? Fact - Nothing, not even light can escape the gravitational force of a black hole. Do you agree? Fact - A black hole is, put simply, a hole in space (maybe time, no-one knows) created by the "implosion" of a strong gravitational source (say a dead star), thus it is in essence pure gravity. Do you agree? Thus, if light cannot escape from a black hole it is affected by gravity, therefore logic dictates that a strong enough gravitational source could both slow down and speed up light (or more technically Photons, which are particles of light).

@ ender - not according to Hawking, he believes wormholes are linked to time travel.

Is your point that you still think that FTL is just a velocity?, or that light cannot escape from a black hole?How can you say FACT about a black hole, then say no one knows?Nobody knows anything about black holes really, it's all conjecture and opinions. And your not being serious about Einstein(and the whole scientific community) are you? There's a reason it's called science fiction.(worm holes)

Its science fiction. Who really cares what theories are sound and what we actually know or dont know because we havent witnessed it yet. its very plausible for FTL to be in the movie, but i wouldnt think so. In all the shots we saw of the ship its using thrusters and traveling to each planet without warp speed.

Okay... The speed of light is 186,282 miles per second. For something to exceed this speed, would be to travel FTL. Therefore FTL is a velocity. Black Holes exist, they have been identified many times over, especially in the center of galaxies. There is probably one man alive that knows more about them than anyone, his name is Professor Stephen Hawking. Professor Stephen Hawking is probably the most eminent member of the scientific community alive today. And yes I'm being serious about Professor Albert Einstein. Yes he may have been a genius, but that doesn't make him flawless, infallible and incapable of error, and his two best known theories contradict each other, as I already stated. The facts are as I laid them out, are they not? Thus the logic in my statement about FTL being theoretically possible stands.

The words black holes and fact should not really be mentioned in the same sentence. Black holes like everything else that have not been proven by experiment.. are theoritical. Theusprom - what do you make of this new Dredd movie? couldnt be any worse than the old one? Used to be a huge 2000 AD nut - havent picked it up in years.

Black Holes have been proven by observation (by astronomers and NASA). Proving them by experiment, I don't think anyone with half a brain cell should even attempt it.

FTL, in nature itself, has been all but proven possible - at least on the subatomic scale. Google 'neutrinos are faster than light,' and you'll learn about the battery of tests that were very recently concluded that revealed that neutrinos can surpass the velocity of photons. http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/nov/18/neutrinos-still-faster-than-light

[quote]@ Enderwiggin Theusprom - what do you make of this new Dredd movie? couldnt be any worse than the old one? Used to be a huge 2000 AD nut - havent picked it up in years. [/quote] I really, really hope they get it right this time, and from the screenies I have seen it looks promising.I spent my teenage years reading 2000 AD, love it.I Especially love Carlos Ezquerra's artwork on Dredd, amazing. [IMG]http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii283/Evilqtl_2007/Misc/1664c.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii283/Evilqtl_2007/Misc/dreddKoburn.jpg[/IMG] Love it!

[quote]@ Manndroid FTL, in nature itself, has been all but proven possible - at least on the subatomic scale. Google 'neutrinos are faster than light,' and you'll learn about the battery of tests that were very recently concluded that revealed that neutrinos can surpass the velocity of photons.[/quote] Not quite. [url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/nov/21/faster-than-light-neutrinos-doubts]speedymk2[/url]

@Theusprom Neither report is conclusive. Therefore, the former can't be dismissed because of the apprehension of the latter. Whether it'll be proven as fact or not, I think we've all lost touch of the fact that we're discussing a science fiction film with spacecraft that, despite not utilizing a centrifuge - have earth-like gravity. ;)

@ theusprom... I too am hoping they get Dredd right this time round. Regards the doubts, this is always the case, and is in part, part of my point - one scientist says yes, another says no, another says maybe, another says if etc. etc. Their whole process is wrong (theory - hypothesis - experiment - conclusion - reword - proof). For example... We've all heard of dark matter, yes? Do you know why scientists contest that it exists? because their observations of the rotational speeds of galaxies weren't predicted by their mathematical "standard model". So, instead of re-writing their precious "standard model" they added a "clause" style equation that made their equations match their observations, and this "clause" states that there must be more mass than is apparently present for their observations to work within their equation. They refuse to believe that their equation, their model, their theory could be wrong.

It cannot be verified either then , so why post it? :) The discussion wasn't about time travel being in the movie, but what FTL actually was. You know the effect of that experiment had on the scientific community, they went bat shit obviously because it turned physics on it's head. I really hope it's not in Prometheus as I personally don't think time travel belongs in the ALIEN universe, but it did work in the Star Trek reboot.They could easily write it into the plot, but imho I wouldn't like it.

@Theusprom Getting back to the point of the matter, I don't think we'll have to worry about FTL in Prometheus. At least, not from humans. Whether the Jockeys, or other sources, utilize it may be another matter - but, like I said, this is science fiction. Previous Alien glossed over scientific facts in regards to physics and so-on, so I don't see its inclusion as a horrid offense, especially if it uses a model like extra-dimensional or temporal assimilation; that is, imprinting a object in space over its own paradox twin in another dimension or time. All of which is based on theory. Barely. When it comes to something like this, the plot and the ideas are more important than the verifiable science behind it. Ridley Scott is a very thematic, philosophical director - the setting is simply that. I wouldn't expect, nor deplore the lack of, hard science.

@ Theusprom - I agree, please no time travel in Prometheus, otherwise next we'll have Aliens versus Terminator.

@Snorkelbottom - That's bad? Then we can finally have Aliens vs. Predator vs. Robocop vs. Terminator!

Don't forget Doctor Who, Timecop, Deaths Head etc. etc.

Well, I was combining prominent X vs. X mash-ups done in the past. Robocop vs. Terminator was an arcade game, like Aliens vs. Predator.

In that case put batman, superman, judge dredd, marvel, capcom, snk, tekken etc. into the mix. Ryu hadokens a Xenomorph, the acid burns supes cape, the resulting smoke chokes batman, he bends down, robocop trips over him (not looking where hes going), squatting spiderman like a fly, spidermans guts get on dredds visor causing him to blindly (maybe) shoot Jin Kazama in the foot, who in his pain filled reaction punches the terminator into the tardis, killing van damme.

Snorkel - where can I contact your agent?

It's a testament to Alien fans that we can skip from conversations about theoretical physics to super hero match ups with relative ease. Sorry to have harp on about this but black holes are theoretical, by their very nature they cannot be observed. Only we when we can get close enough to interact with them will they be proven. Also bring on the Dredd movie, ABC warriors next please. And lastly please no FLT travel in prometheus, the standard model is all I can get my head around at the moment.

Last comment, I promise... Black Holes by their very nature cannot be observed, but the side effects can. @ Manndroid - My agent, I wish.

#1 Black holes are a virtual certainty among the scientific community, and it's a forgone conclusion that every galaxy has a supermassive black hole at it's galactic core. Some people get all metaphysical when it comes to black holes and thus question their existence. It's simply an object that is so massive that it's escape velocity exeeds the speed of light. The one at the center of the Milky Way is about 3.7 million solar masses. We know light can be bent by gravity (see gravitational lensing), so given enough mass the light is bent back on itself and render the object invisible. Although you can't observe them visually, their effects are easily discernable. #2 FTL is a speed (faster than light). It's a simple acronym. Now it is theorized that if an object could travel FTL without using some type of special drive/trick (I hate to say it : Warp), then time travel would be a result. But Einstein says NO to that. One theoretical partical that does travel faster than light is the Tachyon, but that is completely theoretical. The reason a Tachyon could move faster than the speed of light is because it has a negative mass. The Nutrino situation is interesting because it does have a very very small non zero mass. But even if it's confirmed, you can't make real stuff (like you can with protons, neutrons, and electrons) out of nutrinos. It might make a useful communication method. IMO, the best chance we'll ever have of going FLT is using some sort of trick like warping space. Space time is contracted ahead of the vessel and expanded behind the vessel. Now back to Prometheus. FTL is used as a plot device in almost all science fiction because it would take to long to get anywhere interesting without it. If the crew of the prometheus is traveling to Zeta Reticula it would take 39 years to make the journey at the speed of light. If it takes less than 39 years in the movie--BAM--they are traveling FTL. In the grand scheme of things, 39 light years is a paultry distance. The mere center of the Milky way is around 27000 light years away. I do like how the ALIEN universe uses hypersleep to augment space travel. They don't go overboard on the FTL speed like Star Trek. In Star Trek they Would just crank up the speed to Warp 9.5 and be at Zeta Reticuli in a little over 5 days, hehe. Now on to the derelict ship. I have a strong believe that the ship(s) are at least biomechanical in nature, and quite possibly sentient life forms in their own right. Maybe they obtain power from converting organic material to energy (aka eat/digestion) which could be a creepy plot device. It might also have the capability to self repair and/or heal any damage? Sorry for the long winded response.. Sci Fi + Prometheus speculation + theoretical physics = fun conversation.